rear quater window regulator issues

[mikeadelic_1]

Hi all
Am loving my cc however the rear window has stopped working & i have been told that this is a broken regulator that will cost approx £190 +vat just for the part

Any advice would be greatly welcome

thanks

Mike

[ChrisM]

Welcome to my world!
I have been having rear quater light reg problems for 6 months now, first one would stop working usually in the open position and just click, so I would have to turn off car, then re-start car and window will then wind up! eventually it stopped altogether luckily for us we got it to go up before it expired so at least the car was secure. Roof still worked fine.
Bought one from Ebay from a scrap car, £50, fitted it, worked a treat for about 2 months, I did notice one morning that it was pushing up the roof slightly when it was closed so I thought "must adjust that at the weekend" well no chance, roof down, ride home, roof up and just as it met the roof there was a thud and the wonderful sound of chewing cables! excellent timing! you can now push this window up and down by hand................ SO back into the garage I went found the old broken one and re-fitted it, well at least it is stuck at the top and can't be pushed down.
Job done, put roof up and down go ALL 4 windows. NO I thought not that one, but t hat rear passenger quarter light worked fine, and has done for 2 months, then about a week ago we dropped roof in Llandudno drove home, stopped at aa junction in Rhos and BANG! sounded like some had launched a stone through one of the rear windows, it was really loud, we looked at all the windows no breaks so carried on home put up roof on drive and there is that dreaded sound AGAIN cable chew! at present the reg is in but I have taken the cables off it and used two bolts with rubber washers to "bolt" the window in the up postion (looks better than tape & more secure) so I really do know what you are going through! it is a crap Renault Idea, you have a metal pressed plate which the window mount slides up and down on which is fine, cable runs are good BUT where would be the worst place to put an electric motor, bearing in mind water will always take the easiest route and will only drip when it has nowhere else to go? worst place would be right at the bottom of this regulator, upside down of course so the plug can also fill with water, well when you get it out have a look and see where the motor is!
I am in conversation with a chap on ebay at present who sells replacement cables, he doesn't sell them for the rears but we are trying to "make" a set so we will see, £190 + vat is a very good price, is that genuine renault? last time I spoke to a tec about them he said they are around £300, Fitting is quite easy really, but you have to take the roof off to get to the rear seat torx bolts and lift it out, I find it easirer to work as well with it off I can do the job now in just under an hour, it is not as bad as it looks. Will give you a step by step if you want.
Consensus seems to be I broke the scrap yard one by not adjusting it correctly there are 3, 10mm nuts you slacken which allows you to move the window around so it seats correctly against the roof seal, you also adjust the close height here as well, which I did not do, so the motor was lifiting the roof joint slightly, which eventually broke the plastic cable guide inside the reg. the 2nd one which was the cars origonal one we think has a processor problem, which is why it worked when the car was switched off then back on, and "worked" when it was installed the 2nd time, but it seemed not to know when to stop the window motor, so it did the same and broke the plastic cable guide but with a lot more force. this time the window was adjusted correctly.
So they are a bit of a pain, yet my driver side one works fine! Plus side roof still works fine, so I am tempted to leave it bolted in the up postion, well till summer comes around again at least!

[k993802]

afternoon all!

I am also in a position where my regulator needs replacing. I put the roof back up, then all windows up and just as they had all raised the read left window made a loud bang noise - subsequent attempts to move the window resulted in tangled/spinning cable noises.

so, I need a new regulator as the motor was happy to pull the window down, it just wouldn't move it down. (now it doesn't move it at all.

As I'm too tight fisted to pay £300 to get it replaced I'm going to source a replacement (new or scrap yard sourced - or this new fangled ebay cable replacement ChrisM <wink!>).
Its been broken for a month now - I just keep pulling it into the up position every day or so - but this isn't particularly secure.

I haven't been able to find a source of rear window regulators or cable packs for a Megane CC (mines a 2004), only Megane Hatch 2003+ or Megane I Convertible. Anyone know a decent source? In the mean time i'll have to get scouring the Scrap Yards!

A step by step guide to accessing the rear window regulator would be a great help if anyone could provide one (i believe that you have to lift off the rear seats?

I've found a rough guide to accessing the Rear Window Regulator , but can't find the link - i'll post it on tonight when I get to my favorites list on my home PC.

Cheers!

[ChrisM]

Yes I have been having a lot of trouble finding one, no luck yet, I used two nuts N bolts with some rubber washers to secure the window. I also remove my mangles cables as well, everything still works fine.
to remove reg! Oh the fun!!!
Drop roof
push front seats forward for standingroom,
1)rear seat is removed base 1st by prising up the base out of the lugs with a screwdriver, there are 3 one in the middle one either side. to put back slide it in place and push down sharply on the area where the lugs are you will hear in engage.
2) backrest, thereare two plastic panels that have to be reomved up by the rear mindows where the roof support comes through, pull them towards you and push towards the front of the car, once you get one off you can see how they work to remove. once removed look inside you will see a U bracket held in place by a torx bolt one either side, undo them, you will also need a 17mm socket to remove the loswer seat belt securing bolts under the base, as you will need to feed the seatbelt through the slot in the back rest to get it out, sounds hard but it is quite simple really.
Next the whole of the rear panel is now exposed. I now remove the lower seat belt bar with the large Torx bolt (makes the job easier) undo the bolt, remove, push bar back and then twars you, it is J shaped inside so you need to disengauge the bottom of the J and pull side ways is is in a hole and a slot as in - . the Bottom of the J fits through the slot.
open car door and pull up trim next to rear panel as this locks the panel in place, carefullt take out the small black plastic pins that hold the large seal in place at the top of the door by the window thereare 3 of them, once these are out move insideagain and with a flat blade screwdriver turn then lift out the black panel securing pins, the panel will now lift away (remove the window and speaker wires), it is quite tight at the top as it is secured by small grippers it will come off, now carefully prise up seal it splits at the front but is joined by the boot lid so be careful there is also a little plastic lug inside by the boot lid. do not remove completly just drape over the rear head rests, now there are 2 10mm bolts to remove next to the glass and one inside the panel, lift reg and window up a little and realease the plug and lift out carefully.
Sorry it is a bit hurried but running out of time I removed cables from motor, then bolted motor back to reg pushed window up as far as it would go and bolted through the reg slots, you will see what I mean when it is out, hey presto window secure!
Chris, any question ask, will try and answer tomorrow!It is not as bad as it looks! honest

[k993802]

Thank ChrisM - great reply! I'm sure many others will find that step by step very helpful!

Here's the post that was on another forum - no where near as complete as ChrisM's, but I said i'd post it so here it is!

"A long one for you here, you need to take the rear seats out first. There are 2 covers on either side above the seat back, take the roof down first and remove these coversCAREFULLY and there will be a torx30 under both. When these are out pull the seat back up and rest it on the back of the car now pull your seat bottom up forcibly because the clips are tight. there are 3 at the front either side and 1 in the middle, undo the seat belts and rest them on the seat back. you'll now need to tske the front seatbelt mounting bar off, torx50. unclip the bar and you should be left with the panel, there's 3 twisty clips undo these and take up the front kick trim thats connected to the 1/4 panel trim. pull up on the 1/4 panel trim and with a bit of work it'll come out. then you'll find a grey seal which covers the regulator. be careful because that'll need to be restuck on when you're done. On the black window seal you'll see 2 small black clips, be careful with these, when they are out lift up the seal and remove 2 10mm bolts and the 10 mm bolt you can see under the grey seal and maneuver the regulator out. Before that though i'd disconnect the regulator connector, blow it out and check it then, it'll probably work, even better if you can get a new regulator just remove the lil black bit off the top, swap it over with the motor and window in situ and you'll not need to take the window out. Hope I helped!"

[ChrisM]

*********************************************************************************************************************
Just re-read the above and there is a mistake, you need to take the base out 1st, otherwise you will not be able to remove the backrest because of the rear seat belts, once the base is out you can see the belt anchor points, a 17mm socket will undo them [ 1 on each side], as the belts need to be threaded through the backrest when you remove it *******************************************************


Glad you got the Torx sizes, my set is a bit old now and the sizes have worn off.
Just be careful with the two plastic covers on either side of rear seat back, you will need to first pull it up by the window as it is clipped there it also has a lug which holds it against the quater panel trim this will just slide out as well the covers are quite flexible, then pull it towards the window (it does slide), now I can never remember which side to pull up on, so I usually tug away before it becomes obvious but I am sure it is the front comes up first [ side facing the front of the car], they are fairly tight so you will battle a bit with them.
Seat base is no problem
Seat back is no problem
Rear seat belts no problem, bit fiddly to feed them back through the rear seat slots make sure there is no twists!
Front seat belt lower slider, easy to remove just a bit fiddly to get out just hink of a J the tail of the J faces the outside of the car, the long back of the J is what the belt sildes on, so undo the Torx push the J towards the back of the car so the tail clears the hole it is positioned in, then bring it towards the inside of the car do not twist it keep it level and it will come out of the slot, I push it back then slightly towards me then forwards in jabs whilst moving more towards me until the end to the J finds the slot and out it comes fitting is easy as you will see how it works, simple really just hard to explain.
Remember to lift up the door kick trim as this locks the side panel in place, just the corner need come up, pops up easy just held in place by plastic clips, can be done by hand.
The plastic pins that hold the quter panel Trim in place I have 4 one hides behind the rear seat belt, again simple, flat balde screwdriver bit of a turn on the m and you will see them lift a bit use the blade then to lift the pins right up then the clip should pop out if not a little gental help with the blade as a lever will pop them out, fitting.... what I found easier was to pick this clip up look at the end that fits inside the panel you will see the pin and a larger base to it so it dose not fall out, they can be pigs to put back in so I use my thumb nail to lift one the palstic legs slighlty so I can remove the pin, refitting is then made easy.
The panel comes out at the bottom slightly, then out at the front to disengauge the plastic pin holding it halfway down the panel, where the front seat belt slot is basically then panel lifts up to remove it from the clips up by the window, don't for get the window switch and speaker connections, seat belt is feed out of panel slot, panel is now FREE!!! when refitng panel I find it easier to pop out the seat belt slot trim from the slot as it is quite hard to get the front seat belt back through because of the long plastic sheath on the belt it is the trim that makes it hard to get through the plastic gets caught on it, also make sure no twists, the same when you refit the lower slider, make sure the belt is the right way around. Whatch out for bits of foam that fall out as they stop rattles so take note where they go there are 2 suposedly stuck, but not always!
Window seals in and out side, carefully pull them up the inside one is quite easy the outside may need some help but be gental they are not joinedat the front by the door bur are at the rear by the boot so don't be to rough, there is a small plastic plug on the inside by the boot lid, both seals will lift away but DO NOT remove completely, sit them around the rear head rests, remove reg cover carefully as you will need to tape it back in place after.
you should now have the bear panel exposed, now looking at the top of the panel you will see 4 x 10mm bolts, you need to remove only 2 of them, the outside ones I think as this is a mounting bracket and needs to come out with the reg once undone (you will need a long extension and a UJ to get to the rear one if you window is up) take both bolts out, now look down to hole you removed the foam reg cover from you will see anther small bracket and a 10mm bolt this stops the reg from swinging take it out, a small scredriver (flat blade) as my hands are to big to get to the reg conector, there is a plastic clip which needs to be lifted slightly to allow the conector to be pulled off DO NOT break it, once the conector is off the whole lot can be lifted up and out.
This is what you will see, the glass is bolted to the regulator by 3 x 10mm bolts make a mental note of them, they corispond to the 3 round rubber/plastic gromets on the bare rear panel (these are used to adjust the rear window when it is shut) you wont need to worry about these at present but you will if you fit a new reg or cables.
the motor! now if you want to preserve you motor then remove the cables, to do this you will need an 10 mm socket I think and take off the 3 nuts that hold the motor on, once these are off you will be able to remove the motor turn it over and remove the 3 threded bolts that initially held the motor on, this will enable you to remove the face plate of the motor, before you remove the plastic intrnal wheel mark with touchup paint which cable goes where as there are two one winds from t he top and one from the bottom, I marked one of them with red paint corisponding to which cable and clip it went into and if it was top or bottom of the wheel, once this is done unravel it and take out cables. at this point you can ascertain if you need cables or a new reg.
How you may think, well :
1 the white plastic clips on the reg how badly is it damaged, you can not glue them not even super glue will stick them, I was lucky I had 2 regs so I can make a good one from the 2 as the same white plastic clip had broken on both of them.
2 What is the plastic wheel like inside the motor? when you open it you will notice the wheel is threaded for the cables to follow like a guide do they don't knot up, on my first reg I used the motor to many times with the chewed cables so the plastic threaded wheel is knackerd all the threads have been flattened by the cables, I supose with care you could recut them but my other motor is ok. nobody actually makes cables for these so we are humming and haring about trying them.
OK, once you have decided what to do you need to re-asemble the motor anyway and bolt it back on the reg, you will notice the window will now move up and down with ease so your car is NOT SECURE, what you need is two 14mm bolts with nuts or nyloc nuts and rubber washers, length about 35mm thread width 7mm, you don't want it to wide as it will not fit through the slides, push the glass to the top of its travel, and bolt it there, tight, I used both bolts one in each slide. you will find now window is solid, and can not be pushed down.
so put it back in the car, remember to reconect to window motor as I don't think the roof will work without this motor conected.
I put mine back in bolted the the reg in place but before I went on to put the panel back on I tried the roof to see if it would come up just to make sure there where no problems before I went ahead and put it all back together.
So there ya go, long winded but not actually that hard once you start to get into it., when I 1st did it it took me around 1.5 hrs to complete to give you some kind of idea of time scale.

[k993802]

ok, wow, thanks for the detailed instructions!

So i'm currently stood in my car feeling very proud that i've managed to remove the seat base. Step 1 complete!

It seems to have gone very cloudy here, hope it doesn't rain! Lol

[k993802]

oh arse, I just can't get the three plastic panel retaining screws off! The ones you turn with a flat head then pull - just not coming out!! Pretty annoying, buti'll persist!

[k993802]

ah-ha! Having resorted to pliers, I can confirm that the inner screw bit of each of the 3 black plastic plugs must be screwed out be about half an inch before the whole plug can be removed! Neighbours have just come round for a laugh at me and my car that is now in bits!

Anywayback plugs out. Getting dark though, can't really see much!

And I can't get the front lower seatbelt arm thing off - the torx bolt is done up too tight for my screwdriver torx to undo - will persist nonetheless!

[k993802]

christ! Its a bit serious under that panel! Just disconnected the speaker and elec window switch.

[k993802]

ok, its too dark to do anything else tonight.

I have however, managed to disengage the regulator wire that was stopping the window from fully closing [and then needing 10 mins of up&down playing with the window switch while pulling the glass up!] so at least I can use my roof without needing to spend an age fiddling with the window to make it close!

To be continued...

[k993802]

Horrah!!

I've removed the window assembly!

Its incredible the difference a bit of daylight can make!

I was expecting to see a whole load of frayed, rusted and broken wire, however all of the wire and connectors appear to be intact. So it must be the regulator unit that guides the wire that the motor winds.



Highlighted areas 1 & 2 show the cable connectors are not broken

Highlighted area 3 shows where the wire enters the regulator - the wire does not appear to be exactly where it should be.

so i'm now going to attempt to open the regulator - if this can be done....

Incidently, the glass that is not exposed when the window is fully extended is REALLY dirty - yuk!

[k993802]

Ah-ha! the culpret!



hmmm - now what? i think i need to find a regulator...!!

[k993802]

OK,

so is this the motor that is knackered or the regulator with the motor being the silver metal bit in the photo above.
Does anyone know? I kinda need some help in identifying what it what...

Thanks loads for your help ChrisM!

[davelowe]

so is this the motor that is knackered or the regulator with the motor being the silver metal bit in the photo above.
Does anyone know? I kinda need some help in identifying what it what...

Thanks loads for your help ChrisM!

Interesting. I wouldn't know without looking at it. I would assume that the silver bit is a motor. You would have to have a look around the cable wheel bit to see if there are any sensors or switches in it. I would have thought that the circuit probably just measures the load current of the motor to sense when the window is fully up or down ie when it detects the motor has stalled (also it may measure the operating time), it stops sending a current. That would be the simplest design, especially if there are only 3 pins on the connector.

Assuming the window cable / glass is disconnected, I would plug the connector back on to the wiring loom and try to open/close the window with the usual switches to see if it spins both ways. You could also try manually jamming it while it's running (by hand? take care!) to test whether stalling it stops the current (both direction). That might pin point what is what.