FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Problem with your Megane? Can't find an answer? Workshop manuals and technical notes are in here.

Moderators: q292u, Ray, AndyAdmin, Stranger

catherine c
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2008 5:41 pm
Location: Berkshire

FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby catherine c » Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:04 pm

Since I've had my 06 reg Megane 1.9 dci from new, i've had problems with the FAP filter. After around 8 months I noticed when changing up a gear that I would lose power. Eventually there was a big puff of white smoke out of the back, and the car lost all oomph altogether. The Renault dealer said the FAP filter was blocked, and spent 3 days driving it around Berkshire at high revs to unblock it. OK it was under warranty, but I'm without my car for those days, and when i asked for a new filter they said they would try this first because a new one is worth £1000.

Well now a year later it's happening again. I never get the messages on my dash telling me that the FAP is regenerating, as the handbook tells me I should, but apparently the computer shows that it has been doing so.

Does anyone else have these problems?

By the way i do around 60 miles per day, a mixture of motorway and town driving (don't know if that would have any bearing on the problem).
Catherine

User avatar
IainMW
F1 Driver
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 5:48 pm
Currently Drives:: Laguna III 2.0dCi 150 Dynamique Hatchback. Pearl Black, Panoramic Sunroof, Front & Rear Proximity Sensors, 17" Spider Alloys (with B****y expensive tyres on!)
Location: In the Foot Hills of the Valley of the Pie Eaters!

Postby IainMW » Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:00 am

catherine c

I don't think many members have FAP fitted Meganes?
This is the official information from Renault on FAP technology https://www.renault.co.uk/Innovations.aspx?page=fap

Not being an expert on how the regenration process work I can only summise that there is a problem with the regeneration process? (ECU problems?) :?

The car has to be driven according to the procedures in the above link (and your hand book) so that regeneration can take place. If the regeneration does not take place correctly during driving then your dealer can force regeneration (but only so many times before the filter has to be replaced I believe?)

What percentage of you daily drive is motorway driving? I can only guess that it's not enough to allow the reneration to complete?

It's very poor that your dealer has not found out why you are not getting the warning message when regeneration is taking place. Not good enough in my opinion
Make improvements, not excuses!
Laguna III 2.0dCi 150 Dynamique Hatch. Pearl Black, Panoramic Sunroof, Front & Rear Proximity Sensors, 17" Spider Alloys (with B****y expensive tyres fitted!)

catherine c
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2008 5:41 pm
Location: Berkshire

Postby catherine c » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:04 am

Thanks for the link. I've got a service booked for 8 March, and I'll ask them to look at the lack of indication on the dashboard then regarding regeneration. Otherwise the only way I know it's due is when I lose performance (and you get a burning rubber smell from the car too). I tend to do about 24 miles of motorway every day, so around 20 minutes I suppose at normal speed. However, some days it might be as much 100-200 miles. I was never told at the time of purchase that urban driving only with a FAP might be a problem. Apparently 'all diesel cars are going the way of fitting FAP filters.'
Catherine

User avatar
IainMW
F1 Driver
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 5:48 pm
Currently Drives:: Laguna III 2.0dCi 150 Dynamique Hatchback. Pearl Black, Panoramic Sunroof, Front & Rear Proximity Sensors, 17" Spider Alloys (with B****y expensive tyres on!)
Location: In the Foot Hills of the Valley of the Pie Eaters!

Postby IainMW » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:33 pm

It sounds to me like your daily drive should be sufficient to allow regeneration of the FAP, so there must be a fault somewhere? :?

The problem was that many people who bought FAP fitted Renaults were not informed of the specific operating requirements of them, but that was down to Renault UK not training dealers properly.

Yes, once Euro V standards are compulsary all Diesels will be fitted with particle filters. :(

However not all manufacturers use the same system as Renault (i.e. you need to drive at a certain speed to force regeneration)

Peugeot/Citroen and Mercedes use a chemical additive (Urea based I think?) that is injected into the fuel system to raise the exhaust gas temp to enable regeneration to take place!
Make improvements, not excuses!
Laguna III 2.0dCi 150 Dynamique Hatch. Pearl Black, Panoramic Sunroof, Front & Rear Proximity Sensors, 17" Spider Alloys (with B****y expensive tyres fitted!)

chrisd59
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:37 am
Currently Drives:: Megane Sports Tourer 1.9Dci

Re: FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby chrisd59 » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:51 pm

Hi,

I just started getting the same problem - the FAP warning light has come on twice since Xmas Eve and despite running the car at speed for half hour up and down the M4 (how is that supposed to be green??) it has come on for the second time. Unfortunately due to hospital visits it has been 2 days before I could do another half hour speeding up and down the M4. I too was not made aware of this stupid piece of engineering when I bought the car. If you live in a really big city, do stop start driving all day and don't have access to a fast road how the heck are you supposed to regenerate this thing? Is it covered by the warranty?

User avatar
WebCode
Rally Driver
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:48 pm
Location: In England but Scottish by Birth!!

Re: FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby WebCode » Sun Jan 18, 2009 10:46 am

My 1st question is what ACEA grade of oil has been used when the vehicle has been serviced.. It MUST be C3 like this http://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-878-motul-8100-x-clean-5w-40-acea-c3-gasoline-diesel-lubricant-for-euro-iv-engines.aspx

If you use a lower grade with higher sulphur, ash content it will Rapidly block the Fap..

As an example my friend has a Fap equipped Scenic.. It has been serviced within the schedules by the supplying maindealer. They take it on holiday, driving back the car looses power and blows one of the boost pipes clean off. It is recovered the the dealer who diagnose that the Fap is completely blocked.. It is replaced under warranty..
I visit my friend and take a look at the service invoices only to find that the dealer had been filling the car with low grade 10w40 bulk.. This is the reason for the destroyed Fap.. The dealer firstly tried to get out of it by saying that the bulk oil was actually C3 graded and the invoice description was wrong. But eventually rellented and admitted the mistake and apologised..
Now more importantly that that when the Fap was replaced, guess what they changed the oil and filled with cheap bulk!!! This was rapidly removed and filled with the correct grade..

My friend then called Renault customer services and complained about the incorrect oil grade being used. Renault agree that it is wrong and have negotiated a 2 year extended warranty on the Fap for future failure due the mistake..
I hope Renault have seriously Bolloked the dealer for this fundamental failure in service detail.. However I doubt it.
EX Renault Dealer Technician & MOT Tester, Not a Monkey!

Image

AlexB
Driving Legend
Posts: 4309
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 8:17 pm
Currently Drives:: Renaultsport R.S.250 Cup

Re: FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby AlexB » Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:33 pm

Webcode,

Is there yet another confusion with oil specs? In the recently published document (see my message in Links) Renault specifies oil for FAP engines as ACEA C4, and not C3 as you wrote. Furthermore, Motul has published the note saying that their X-Clean is RN0700/RN0710 (see our Links), which does not make it suitable to FAP engines demanding RN0720.

Could you please clarify this issue, as this may result in additional expenses to some of us.
AlexB
(no, a different AlexB)

User avatar
WebCode
Rally Driver
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:48 pm
Location: In England but Scottish by Birth!!

Re: FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby WebCode » Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:04 pm

AlexB Let me clarify..

5w40 ACEA C3 was the origionally specified "minimum" grade for the 1.9DCi 130 with Fap..

With the introduction of the laguna III as per the "oil standards" document that you have correctly published, it does indeed specifiy ACEA C4 specifically for the Fap equipped 2.0DCi M9R engine.

In the case of the 1.9DCi Fap ACEA C3 is still the the specified oil, but ACEA C4 can obviously be used as this is a superior "blend".

But then we have to have the understanding that a 5w40 B4 oil is different to 5w40 C3.. ie: Its not just a case of going into Halfords for example and picking up a 5w40 oil and thinking its the correct one because 5w40 is the oil weight that is in the owners manual for my Fap equipped vehicle without looking at the ACEA grade.. See what I mean?
Not everyone appreciates the significance of the Grading, many just look at the weight.. If you have a Fap the Grade is very significant.

The point of my post was that you must be aware that even today I am sure that the Renault "monkeys" are still filling with poor quality dirty cheap bulk.. Please check your invoices to make sure that the correct grade has been used...

At the dealership I am currently at I still have to constantly remind my Technicians and the oil buyer that we must have C3 grade oil for our Fap equipped vehicles. Even on Wednesday one of them filled a vehicle with 10w40 B3 unaware that it was Fap equipped.. :no Yes I gave him a bolloking and he quickly drained an refilled with the correct stuff. :evil: He won't forget again!! :banghead

The manufacturer of the cars that we sell is actually considering requesting oil samples from us for them to test before they will authorise some warranty jobs.. ie Fap replacement.. and at £2300 each you can understand the reason why! :shock:
EX Renault Dealer Technician & MOT Tester, Not a Monkey!

Image

AlexB
Driving Legend
Posts: 4309
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 8:17 pm
Currently Drives:: Renaultsport R.S.250 Cup

Re: FAP filter keeps getting blocked

Postby AlexB » Mon Jan 19, 2009 12:24 am

Thank you Webcode,

I agree with all your points and I will modify my message in Links. I've found what ACEA write about C4:
"The structure of A/B and C sequences remains unchanged, although a new category, C4, has been introduced. This is a low SAPS, normal viscosity oil aligned with the Renault Long Drain specification."
https://www.infineum.com/information/ACEA_whatsnew.html

One may compare ACEA C3 and C4 specs found here:
https://www.infineum.com/information/ace ... rtreat.pdf
C4 produces upto 40% less sulphated ash (cleaner FAP) and is specified differently w.r.t. black sludge (long life aspect).

Now, it is a big question whether a sensible owner should be using C3 or C4 in Megane II with FAP?
AlexB
(no, a different AlexB)


Return to “Problems / Questions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests