GT 150 DCI

[boysie]

Not really a problem [yet] But my 20 DCI shows a plume of light blue smoke on startup from cold. We have two, and they both do it, so I suppose it's correct? But I've not had this on a car since I had a Mk2 Cortina 30 years ago, and dont feel this is acceptable. Normaly I would say this was due to fauly valve seals. but as both our cars are doing it the same I'm not to sure!! Maybe it will improve with time, as our cars are only a week old.

Does anyone else have a 20 DCI and are you seeing the same

[204driver]

that don't sound right to me. Blue smoke means oil being burnt and that can damage the catalyst.

[Mat]

Sounds like a diesel to me. Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't this usually happen when the cars being run in in particular?

[boysie]

Sounds like a diesel to me. Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't this usually happen when the cars being run in in particular?

Hi, yes it isnt unusual to have a small amount of oil consumption from a diesel motor when running in.. However it is not acceptable to have a large plume of blue smoke emited from a brand new car, when starting up in the morning, and it is not acceptable and to be told by renault that it is perfectly acceptable for my car to use up to 1litre per of oil per 1000 miles, without any technical explanation for such action..... Or am I wrong and this is indeed a two stroke diesel and runs a total loss lubrication system? even if it where this would still be considered high consumption,,, and NOT acceptale.

This will be my third new renault diesel in 5 years, and oil consumption / smoke have never been a issue in the past.

[IainMW]

boysie

You don't state what milleage both of the 150's have done?

Blue smoke on startup can be 2 things: -

1: Unburnt fuel; - because the cylinders are cold and being quenched with fuel, complete combustion is not taking place, the ECU will overfuel slighlty on a cold engine, in order to make it run smoothly. Once a little warmth starts to spread into the cylinders the ECU will adjust the amount of fuel relative to engine load and the smoke should diminish?

2: Oil creeping past the piston rings; - Again not uncommon on a cold, new engine, until you have a little warmth in the engine the piston rings will not seal completely.

High oil consumption is not uncommon in Diesel engines when they are new, just ask any VW PD TDI owner . Usually after a few thousand miles everything starts to "bed in" and your oil consumpion should drop.
Fully synthetic oil which is needed in modern engines can actually make the running in period longer because it's too good at it's job! It stops the slight metal to metal contact that is often needed to knock off all the rough edges so to speak.
One school of thought is to run a semi-synthetic for the first 6000 miles or so and then switch to fully synthetic.
I used to have an N reg Laguna 2.2D (cracking car and engine) this used to exhibit the same symptoms as you describe, acceleration when cold used to produce so much blue smoke that any car behind me needed radar to see where they were going but after 5000 miles it stopped. I've never had much trouble with oil consumption on the various 1.9 dT,dTi's, and dCi's I've had, but the wife's Clio 1.5dCi 80 and my Megane 1.5dCi 100 did use a fair amount of oil in the first 5K-6K. This has now settled down to about a litre every 3000. They do both produce a little blue smoke on the first cold start of the day still.

If you are not happy with your dealers response try another dealer.
My advise would be to monitor the situation, over the next few thousand miles, hopefully once the miles start to accumulate everything should settle down.

[boysie]

boysie

You don't state what milleage both of the 150's have done?

Blue smoke on startup can be 2 things: -

1: Unburnt fuel; - because the cylinders are cold and being quenched with fuel, complete combustion is not taking place, the ECU will overfuel slighlty on a cold engine, in order to make it run smoothly. Once a little warmth starts to spread into the cylinders the ECU will adjust the amount of fuel relative to engine load and the smoke should diminish?

2: Oil creeping past the piston rings; - Again not uncommon on a cold, new engine, until you have a little warmth in the engine the piston rings will not seal completely.

High oil consumption is not uncommon in Diesel engines when they are new, just ask any VW PD TDI owner . Usually after a few thousand miles everything starts to "bed in" and your oil consumpion should drop.
Fully synthetic oil which is needed in modern engines can actually make the running in period longer because it's too good at it's job! It stops the slight metal to metal contact that is often needed to knock off all the rough edges so to speak.
One school of thought is to run a semi-synthetic for the first 6000 miles or so and then switch to fully synthetic.
I used to have an N reg Laguna 2.2D (cracking car and engine) this used to exhibit the same symptoms as you describe, acceleration when cold used to produce so much blue smoke that any car behind me needed radar to see where they were going but after 5000 miles it stopped. I've never had much trouble with oil consumption on the various 1.9 dT,dTi's, and dCi's I've had, but the wife's Clio 1.5dCi 80 and my Megane 1.5dCi 100 did use a fair amount of oil in the first 5K-6K. This has now settled down to about a litre every 3000. They do both produce a little blue smoke on the first cold start of the day still.

If you are not happy with your dealers response try another dealer.
My advise would be to monitor the situation, over the next few thousand miles, hopefully once the miles start to accumulate everything should settle down.

Hi IainMW,

thanks for your response, our cars are only a week old and only done around 500 miles. I understand that this Could be deamed normal, and there's a good chance there is nothing untoward with our cars.
What I dont find acceptable is the response from Renault,, when all I have been told is there's nothing wrong, and that the 20 DCI is too new for them to know anything about them yet. This I find most unacceptable, when infact they have not even had either car in to have a look at the ammount and colour of smoke being emitted..

So it seems I have had a better, and more technical update relating to possible issues with my car on the internet, than Renault themselves can supply....

I have now passed my concerns on to Renault Customer Services, and had no reply in 24 hours...

[Mat]

Yes, I know most Audi's consume a lot of oil also from my time in the trade. They use a litre per 1k in their diesels. Small price to pay for the extra fuel consumption in my opinion.

A lot of new cars use oil during the running in period. But the dealer could definately have been more helpful

[boysie]

Updated:

Both cars now have a few thousand miles on them and the plume of blue smoke continues.
There have been no issues with oil consumption. it seems to be an overfueling issue on cold startup and speeking to other owners they all seem to do it...

Renault Technical are traveling down to view both our cars on friday to give there opinion, though I'm not to sure why as they must have some GT's of there own to look at!!!!

Other issues include an airbag warning light that came on,, and was not the usual loose wire wire under the seat,, we were told it was something to do with software needing updating? Also there is an issue with a noisey door seal that makes a screwping noise!! when the sun is out -]

Hopefully, these issues will be dealt with in full, and renault will accept there is an issue with fueling on this model and sort it.... I wont be happy with the old " it's part of the cars charecter" routine, and if I recieve this response, I will be asking for a full refund

[Woody Woo]

Boysie

Any developments on this yet?




Renault Build A Better Car

[boysie]

Boysie

Any developments on this yet?




Renault Build A Better Car

Hi Woody,

Well, after taking info from the cars ecu, smoke tests, vidoes ect.. it took Renault Technical three weeks to come back and tell us "the smoke is part of the cars charecter" As for the air bag warning light. Both cars have had the software reset twice, as it believes the rear inertia real has been removed,,, but no loose wires have been found as yet

Pity as the car itself drives very well indeed.

[IainMW]

Well at least you know that this is "Characteristic" of the car. As long as it's not using any oil or causing any other problems then ignor it and enjoy your Megane and all the power you have to play with :P

As for the Air bag fault

[boysie]

Well at least you know that this is "Characteristic" of the car. As long as it's not using any oil or causing any other problems then ignor it and enjoy your Megane and all the power you have to play with :P

As for the Air bag fault

Iain,

dying is a "Characteristic" of taking arsenic,, but it's not something you would wish for.... I'm sorry but I find it hard to enjoy this car when I'm just waiting for the next warning lamp to come on!! And to be honest it's not that powerful, Pulling away and getting out of roundabouts shows a lack of grunt down low,, not in the same league as a VW Audi Skoda in that respect,, however it is considerably quieter..

5 / 10 Renault,,,, this car could be so much more, if only better quality control was put in place,,, I personally would rather pay a little more and have a car that I was confident in

[cactusbob]

A puff of smoke from a diesel on startup is quite normal isn't it?

[IainMW]

dying is a "Characteristic" of taking arsenic,, but it's not something you would wish for.... I'm sorry but I find it hard to enjoy this car when I'm just waiting for the next warning lamp to come on!! And to be honest it's not that powerful, Pulling away and getting out of roundabouts shows a lack of grunt down low,, not in the same league as a VW Audi Skoda in that respect,, however it is considerably quieter..

5 / 10 Renault,,,, this car could be so much more, if only better quality control was put in place,,, I personally would rather pay a little more and have a car that I was confident in

Unfortunately as you said it seems

to be an overfueling issue on cold startup and speeking to other owners they all seem to do it...

There is not much you can do about this, the 2.0dCi is too new an engine to work out whether it's going to be a good un or a bad un, although in your case it's already blotted it's copy book!
As for it not being that powerful 150bhp and 340NM of torque is a fair amount of grunt. VW's have always had the reputation of having plenty of low down oomph, but I do know what you mean.

Other than the Smoke and the Airbag light, what other problems have you had to only give it 5/10?

[boysie]

dying is a "Characteristic" of taking arsenic,, but it's not something you would wish for.... I'm sorry but I find it hard to enjoy this car when I'm just waiting for the next warning lamp to come on!! And to be honest it's not that powerful, Pulling away and getting out of roundabouts shows a lack of grunt down low,, not in the same league as a VW Audi Skoda in that respect,, however it is considerably quieter..

5 / 10 Renault,,,, this car could be so much more, if only better quality control was put in place,,, I personally would rather pay a little more and have a car that I was confident in

Unfortunately as you said it seems

to be an overfueling issue on cold startup and speeking to other owners they all seem to do it...

There is not much you can do about this, the 2.0dCi is too new an engine to work out whether it's going to be a good un or a bad un, although in your case it's already blotted it's copy book!
As for it not being that powerful 150bhp and 340NM of torque is a fair amount of grunt. VW's have always had the reputation of having plenty of low down oomph, but I do know what you mean.

Other than the Smoke and the Airbag light, what other problems have you had to only give it 5/10?

There are other little issues such as the odd rattle and a creaky door, but I can live with those [ this is my third new renault ] 5/10 is directed at Renault and for the fact they are happy to put a car on the market when they must clearly be aware that there is a lack of R&D They seem happy to continue going down the road of disatisfied customers,,, the 150 gt is a good car and if they could eradicate reliability issues. I for one would be a lot more inclined to buy another at some point..